Saturday, June 14, 2008

A Telling Weekend for the Future of Superman?

Hey folks. SSS here, back after a bit of a hiatus to my "home world." I hope I didn't impregnate any of you before I left? Anyway, just popping in to bring up something that was brought up from time to time in the past here, and that is this weekend's release of The Incredible Hulk movie.

This film marks the relaunch of Marvel comic's Hulk franchise. After Ang Lee's disappointing Hulk limped out of theaters a mere 5 summers ago. Marvel decided to go in another direction and reboot one of their flagship characters with a new film that really doesn't contradict Lee's film, but doesn't really build off of it either. A new director, writers, and cast are all in place to give the jade giant a fresh start that focuses more on the action and raw brutality of the character as opposed to meaningless psycho babble and moss growing on rocks.

This was a pretty bold step on Marvel's part being that Lee's film (and horrific images of Nick Nolte) is still fresh in the general public's mind. And if you think the other studios aren't watching this with a close eye, then you're missing the obvious. The success or failure of the film will not only determine the future of the Hulk franchise but could also have a huge trickle-down effect in the comic movie industry as a whole for any character who left a lot to be desired in a previous film incarnation like say Superman.

Will studios continue to shelve these otherwise bankable characters because previous directors blew it? Or will they wipe the slate clean and start from scratch in a few years? TIH could go a long way in determining that, as this is the first time a character has gone through a reboot after a failed film venture in so short a time. TIH will really be the test case for this type of approach. If it succeeds, its a great incentive for studios like WB to wipe the slate clean with characters like Superman and start anew instead of dancing around the issue of whether they're going to go ahead with another Singerman sequel. (How's that coming BTW?) Obviously this won't be the sole determining factor, but it will give a strong precedent.

So far the critics seem to semi-like the new Hulk film, but as we all know here most critics don't tend to see eye to eye with the general populace and at times will even like pretentious crap that the public doesn't buy. The proof, as they say, is in the pudding and we'll likely have a better idea once the weekend box office tallies come in. For anyone hoping to see a new actual Superman franchise in the next decade or even a rebooted character like Daredevil, its really in our best interests that TIH do well. Stay tuned for updates as they become available.

UPDATE 6/19: Box office figures are in and TIH looks like it pulled in $55.4 million domestic in it's opening weekend. Not a great weekend, but not terrible either. (although Ang Lee's film made $62 million in its 1st weekend) Through Wednesday TIH has made $70.7 million and should break the $100 million mark by the weekend. Not really figures that wow you, but this weekend will be really important to see what kind of legs the film will have. Hulk in 2003 (69.7%) and Singerman (58.5%) both fell on their faces in their second weekends with huge drop-offs. We'll see how TIH looks come Sunday. It will need to have a drop-off closer to that of Batman Begins (43.4%) if it hopes to have some staying power.

42 comments:

Anonymous said...

NICE TO SEE YOU BACK SSS!

Anonymous said...

Saw the new Hulk today, it was pretty good, much better than the 2003 version but not great. A bit chopped up in places, you could tell they left a lot on the cutting room floor. Made 54 mil this weekend so unless it has great WOM, does not look like it will make a lot more than Singerman. Probably needed to be a huge hit for WB to reboot Superman anytime soon.

Sepharih said...

Good to see new updates SSS.

And yeah...a decent opening weekend for the Hulk, but nothing spectacular.
I did my part, but right up until the release date I was talking to people who still didn't understand that this movie had no relationship to Ang Lee's Hulk.

Anonymous said...

TIH only had a production budget of $150 million so it doesnt really HAVE to make what Singerman made. Wonder what sort of dropoff it will have next week?

Anonymous said...

No..But, it should at least be able to beat the Original movie. Which, it's not going to do unless WOM is incredibly strong. It's 8 million shorter for the opening weekend when ticket prices are higher. So, what does that tell you?

If I were an executive for DC and I'm watching this to make up my mind, I would be more leery then ever. What is the point in rebooting a franchise if it's not going to out perform the original? It's not to please the fanboys I can tell you that.

I think it's going to make money and probably do better than it's budget, but, it is not the slam dunk that the WB's executives would have liked to see in helping them make their decision. If anything, it muddies the waters even further.

Anonymous said...

What's going on here?! Are the apologists coming out in droves against the Hulk film?! I'd expect that at the Homopage, but not here?!

Advice: go watch the film for yourself, & forget the Internet Morons! That's without a doubt what ruins many a good project anyway, all the idiots on the Internet, self-proclaimed authorities on everything!

Anonymous said...

I know we all want a Superman reboot but we can't look at TIH as that means to an end.

As someone already said TIH budget is only like 150 million and it should easily make that back by summer's end.

Marvel has a plan (The Avengers) unlike WB (Which has no plan even when they own the entire rights of the DC universe).

Marvel isn't afraid to bust some balls to get where they're going. Case in point not backing down to Edward Norton and his demands for a longer different cut of TIH.

If WB had those kind of balls maybe Singer's crapfest would not have cost them like 250 million dollars.

Anonymous said...

Singerman sux cox!

Anonymous said...

"I think it's going to make money and probably do better than it's budget, but, it is not the slam dunk that the WB's executives would have liked to see in helping them make their decision. If anything, it muddies the waters even further."

Exactly, Hulk had to be a huge hit for WB to really look to reboot Superman soon. I really don't think WB is going to do anything with Superman and that sucks. No sequel to SR is good but no reboot is awful and i don't see them doing a damn thing here at all. An investment in any Singer sequel would be costly as would a reboot and the odds are against them making a profit on either one.

Anonymous said...

Good to see you back

Father Finian Egan

Anonymous said...

Cool wirte up about TIH from EW.com:

It [TIH] earned an A- CinemaScore grade and drew a (male-dominated) audience that was evenly divided between young people and old. More incredibly, Universal reports that 82 percent of the crowd for this film had seen Hulk '03, meaning that they weren't deterred from giving the franchise another shot. No wonder the studio is already suggesting there could be a sequel.

^^^
Sounds like this film might pull a Batman Begins and have legs.

Anonymous said...

"Sounds like this film might pull a Batman Begins and have legs."

BB is lightyears better than this movie.

Anonymous said...

What i will never understand is why Singer was given a pay or play deal for another Superman after SR dissapointed at the BO?? That is why everything is dead silent Superman related. Singer comes out every now and then and rambles on about what he wants to do with his next Superman movie and WB says nothing. They obviously have changed their minds about Singer doing another one but they can't just fire him because they have to pay him. Singer is not going to say he is not doing another one because he has a deal that says he is as long as WB gives the go ahead. He quits and he doesn't get paid. So basically this is a game of who will blink first?? I hate WB and Singer, they both fucked this thing up.

Anonymous said...

All the WB execs need to do is pop in a Singerman DVD and watch that gay piece of shit boring movie again to realize they need to reboot.

Anonymous said...

Singer is a FAG and Superman Returns was gay.

Anonymous said...

"All the WB execs need to do is pop in a Singerman DVD and watch that gay piece of shit boring movie again to realize they need to reboot."

They do need a reboot but they screwed up by giving Singer that deal. Now we are at a standstill.

Anonymous said...

Singer has had some tail, just not female.

Anonymous said...

Less then a week and its almost to a hundred million dollars.

And next weeks competition is two lame ass comedies Love Guru (FLOP), and Get Smart, which might be good, but it will probably stink it up at the box office.

Anonymous said...

Hulk will need very good WOM, to go well past 190 mil domestic. 6 mil a day this week, with maybe a 45-50% drop this weekend may have it around 110 mil or so by next mon. It's WOM will make or break it.

Anonymous said...

Watching Superman Returns should require wearing a condom. It's so gay, you might get AIDS.

Anonymous said...

"We'll see how TIH looks come Sunday. It will need to have a drop-off closer to that of Batman Begins (43.4%) if it hopes to have some staying power."

And it is not nearly as good as BB so i don't see it. Marvel is marketing this thing as being as good as Iron Man, which it's not even close to being that good.

Anonymous said...

^ Fuck off, Apologist fuckstain.

Anonymous said...

"Fuck off, Apologist fuckstain."

Your problem is what exactly faggot??

Anonymous said...

Iron man has hit 300 domestic, Damn who would have thought it!

Fearless prediction" Iron Man will be the highest grosser this summer not Dark Knight!

Anonymous said...

From DeadlineHollywoodDaily..

"Holdover The Incredible Hulk self-financed by Marvel and distributed by Universal was No. 3 with a 21M weekend from 3,508 runs and a new $96M cume after Sunday."

It couldn't even make 100 million in it's first two weekends? Hate to break this to everybody, but, if Warners is looking at this film to decide to do a reboot or not then the answer is definitely NO.

This movie isn't going to make it's budget back, the same problem SR had. This movie may effectively kill two franchises at the same time. Because, if I were Marvel, there is NO WAY I would do another movie. I would just wait to put the Hulk in an Avenger movie and be done with him. For whatever reason, he's not a draw.

Anonymous said...

I say bring on Smallville: the movie after the series wraps this spring!

Anonymous said...

"This movie isn't going to make it's budget back, the same problem SR had. This movie may effectively kill two franchises at the same time. Because, if I were Marvel, there is NO WAY I would do another movie. I would just wait to put the Hulk in an Avenger movie and be done with him. For whatever reason, he's not a draw."

Yes this puts the final nail in the coffin i think to the Hulk in films. He had a chance in 2003 but Ang Lee fucked it up so bad that a better version has not really brought in the masses. I think if this version was the one that came out in 2003, it would have done well enough for a sequel, but a 61% drop, it has no shot at 200 mil domestic. Shame because i thought it was pretty good.

Anonymous said...

"This movie isn't going to make it's budget back, the same problem SR had. This movie may effectively kill two franchises at the same time. Because, if I were Marvel, there is NO WAY I would do another movie. I would just wait to put the Hulk in an Avenger movie and be done with him. For whatever reason, he's not a draw."

"Yes this puts the final nail in the coffin i think to the Hulk in films. He had a chance in 2003 but Ang Lee fucked it up so bad that a better version has not really brought in the masses. I think if this version was the one that came out in 2003, it would have done well enough for a sequel, but a 61% drop, it has no shot at 200 mil domestic. Shame because i thought it was pretty good."

What is it with you 2 morons?! I know the latter of you 2 saw it by your own confession. You liked it but you're writing it off already?! You guys say 2 weekends, but that's actually what, 9 days? The international box office puts it at over $127 million, & domestically it's just under $100 million. Whether it makes $200 million domestically BY THE END OF THE SUMMER WHICH ACTUALLY JUST STARTED (emphasis added), I don't know, but I feel confident that it'll DEFINITELY TOP its' $150 million dollar budget.

Get a clue! The film will probably still be in theaters when school starts back in September, & possibly shortly thereafter, It's already been performing fairly well on weekdays, no doubt due to extra matinee showings, kids outta school, the whole summer deal, whatever. It'll probably top $100 million domestically by Tuesday. You mean to tell me that you don't think it can make back its' budget by the end of the summer when it's already THIS close in 9 days?!

Oh, let me guess. I'm dealing with apologists...AGAIN!

Anonymous said...

Oh, & I say 9 days INSTEAD of 10 because box office ESTIMATES are already being posted online, EASTERN TIME, as early as before 3 PM on Sunday afternoon. Sunday's box office doesn't actually end that early, that's why I say 9 days in case that's an issue.

Case in point: last weekend, TIH was ESTIMATED to have made $54.5 million, but when the ACTUALS came in, it was $55.4 million, a difference of nearly a million dollars. So there!

Anonymous said...

Singer wishes the Hulk would pound him in the ass.

Anonymous said...

"Get a clue! The film will probably still be in theaters when school starts back in September, & possibly shortly thereafter, It's already been performing fairly well on weekdays, no doubt due to extra matinee showings, kids outta school, the whole summer deal, whatever. It'll probably top $100 million domestically by Tuesday. You mean to tell me that you don't think it can make back its' budget by the end of the summer when it's already THIS close in 9 days?!"

The movie just dropped, 61% that means BAD WOM, pure and simple. Singerman dropped almost 60% as well and never had any legs but it opened a little better than Hulk in it's first 7 days. Yeah Weekdays will go up a little bit soon, but the weekends are not going to get much better. Hulk will likely make only 10-12 mil next weekend. And TDK is just around the corner and it should be huge. If the Hulk makes like 175-180 mil, on a budget of 150 mil yeah it made it's budget back and made Marvel a little cash but that won't gurantee it gets a sequel and it sure as hell won't convince WB, "We need to reboot Superman right now" Point is we were hoping this was huge so Superman had a better chance to start over, Hulk did not deliver big enough.

Anonymous said...

"You mean to tell me that you don't think it can make back its' budget by the end of the summer when it's already THIS close in 9 days?!""

It's not even at a 100 million and it's had to fucking weekends. And this weekend it's only competition were two comedies. If we are going to blast Superman Returns for it's haul then you have to trash the HULK because it's tracking to make LESS than that movie when ticket prices are higher.

If Warner's is watching the Hulk to decide what to do, then they just got an answer that you don't want them to get.

They still have Hancock and TDK coming up and where do you think those two movies are going to be taking screens from? The Hulk NEEDED to be a SMASH hit for WB's to take notice. All this does is muddy the waters even further because now, THE GRAND MARVEL EXPERIMENT in rebooting is going to be considered a partial success. It was good enough to make people forget, and by people I mean fanboys, Ang Lee's version. But, not good enough to pull the general public in.

I'm not saying that this movie isn't light years better than the first one, because it clearly is, but, you have to take the blinders off here and look at the big picture.

Anonymous said...

"I'm not saying that this movie isn't light years better than the first one, because it clearly is, but, you have to take the blinders off here and look at the big picture."

Yeah, it IS light years better than the Ang Lee pic. I've already seen it twice, & plan to go some more. At least you can believe the Hulk is real in this film as opposed to the animation that stuck out like a sore thumb in the previous film.

"The movie just dropped, 61% that means BAD WOM, pure and simple."

WRONGGGGG!!!!! Oh, sure it may've dropped, but most films do. Even Iron Man dropped the 2nd weekend, but I do realize it made enough to still be the top film, but what happened when Indy came along? Exactly! Another thing, for the apologists around here, this Hulk film opened better than Batman Begins, & Begins went on to make over $200 million. Now, BB would certainly have made A LOT MORE MONEY than it actually did, but, like the Hulk, it had to OVERCOME THE STIGMA OF A PREVIOUS FRANCHISE! Batman Forever, & ESPECIALLY Batman & Robin, left a sout taste for Batman in the general public's mouth, even though the 2 Keaton films did very well. So the Bats franchise was all but destroyed, & when WB decided to reboot the franchise with Nolan & Bale, the film only did so-so, at least at the theater. However, the film was so good that the DVD sold well, it NOW has GOOD word of mouth, & if The Dark Knight does EXTREMELY well, it will be because of the GROUNDWORK that was laid with Begins.

So let's say that the Hulk is in a similar predicament. He has to overcome the bad taste of Lee. The problem, though, is why don't you fanboys give it a chance?! You did with Batman, & NOW about all you hear at some sites is how TDK is going to demolish Iron Man, etc. So why not give Hulk the same benefit of a doubt?!

Oh, & the people I've talked to bragged on the new Hulk, so where's all the bad word of mouth?!

Anonymous said...

"WRONGGGGG!!!!! Oh, sure it may've dropped, but most films do. Even Iron Man dropped the 2nd weekend, but I do realize it made enough to still be the top film,"

RIGHTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT

It dropped 61%, that is worse than what Singerman dropped and it had no competition at all. Two shitty comedies, and it dropped 61%. Iron dropped 48% and has held amazing since then, BB dropped 43% and didn't hold as well after that not surprising, Begins is not as good as Iron Man. So if Hulk dropped worse than Singerman and is tracking to do less at the BO, how is this a success exactly?? Again i am not talking about Hulk doing well enough to get a sequel i am talking about WB taking notice. The film is not a big enough hit for WB to give a shit.

"However, the film was so good that the DVD sold well, it NOW has GOOD word of mouth, & if The Dark Knight does EXTREMELY well, it will be because of the GROUNDWORK that was laid with Begins."

BB has nothing to do with this, Hulk is not nearly as good as BB and it is tracking to make far less than BB at the BO. If you think Hulk is getting BB WOM you are crazy, the reviews were mixed and so is the WOM.

"The problem, though, is why don't you fanboys give it a chance?!"

I gave it a chance, i said i liked it, it was a good flick, but the numbers are what they are.

"NOW about all you hear at some sites is how TDK is going to demolish Iron Man,"

Those people are delusional, TDK has no chance to destroy Iron Man at the BO, Iron Man is likely to make 315 plus mil, TDK is not going to make Spiderman money, just Fanboys getting carried away.

"Oh, & the people I've talked to bragged on the new Hulk, so where's all the bad word of mouth?!"

61% drop at the BO, is where.

Anonymous said...

"Oh, & the people I've talked to bragged on the new Hulk, so where's all the bad word of mouth?!"

61% drop at the BO, is where."

Are you an apologist from the Homopage?

"the reviews were mixed and so is the WOM."

Uh, excuse me, but I myself over the last few weeks have read A NUMBER of reviews for the new Hulk & the consensus seemed to be mostly favorable. Keep in mind this wasn't just fanboy sites like SHH, but also the likes of CNN & MSN, the latter of which rated it 4 stars out of 5, & called it "... solid summer action fare ... a straightforward actioner that delivers the goods with no unnecessary frills or digressions." . Even when I was leaving after my first viewing, I heard positive buzz. There was also positive buzz about the Tony Stark cameo.

If the public is not giving it a chance, it's their loss. This film is phenomenal & DESERVES to succeed! If the fickle public & fanboys want to harp on Ang Lee ad nauseum, that's their problem. By the way, I loved Iron Man, but I only saw it once in the theater; the 2nd time online in poor quality. The Incredible Hulk, however, gets better with EACH viewing, & I still want to go back. As far as I'm concerned, Marvel HAS succeeded in the Hulk reboot, even IF your so-called numbers don't live up to your expectations.

"Hulk is not nearly as good as BB"

WRONGGGGG!!!!! Again! I know you want to lump Hulk in with Fantastic 4 & Ghost Rider as the apologists ARE KNOWN to do, & even though I liked THOSE films as well, in terms of quality & full-blown Marvel action, The Incredible Hulk is TOP NOTCH! I even WANT to see it more than Iron Man, & it certainly had a better battle finale! As for BB, I like that as well, but I only saw it in the theater once also. Next time was on the DVD, which I haven't worn out, incidentally. It's kinda ironic because I saw the '89 Burton film AT LEAST 8 times IN THE THEATER! I loved that so much I wanted to see it OVER & OVER! In ways I looked at BB as being a better overall, more realistic Bat-film, but I've not seen it NEARLY as much!

Now, for the apologist rebuttal that refutes EVERY WORD I JUST SAID! ;)

Anonymous said...

Hey I liked the new Hulk flim, thought it was really fun and the thing is he will be back. Maybe not in another solo film but in the upcoming Avengers film.

Where's your Singerman at? That's right once and done!

Anonymous said...

"If the public is not giving it a chance, it's their loss. This film is phenomenal & DESERVES to succeed! If the fickle public & fanboys want to harp on Ang Lee ad nauseum, that's their problem."


Jesus Christ. You aren't getting what we are fucking saying. We know it was good. We know it deserves to succeed. It didn't however do well enough MONEY.FUCKING.WISE. to make Warner's take notice!!!!! What about that statement is so hard to fucking understand?

I don't care how many times you and your friends saw the fucking film. I myself will be seeing it again. But 61% drop in second weekend numbers is HUUUUUUUUUUGGGGGGGGGEEEELLLLLYYYYYYYYYY DISSAPOINTING if you are watching how this is going to perform to warrant a reboot of Superman. Nobody is laughing here. nobody is saying NANANANANANa HULK MADE NO MONEY. Stop coming at this like you are battling apologists and come at this argument like you are a fucking Warner's executive interested in only one thing....MONEY.

Anonymous said...

"Are you an apologist from the Homopage?"

No but i have a calculator that is working properly, would you like to borrow it??

Anonymous said...

Well, we'll see just how successful Hulk is when it's all said & done. First we'll see the TOTAL BOX OFFICE, both domestically AND internationally, when it finally completes its' run in the coming MONTHS. A note: I wouldn't be surprised if the foreign box office doesn't actually EXCEED the domestic. Why? Well, look at Indy 4. It's grossed less than Iron Man domestically, but its' foreign gross is out-shining Iron Man considerably, & its' TOTAL INTERNATIONAL GROSS puts it being AHEAD of Iron Man, even though it's made less domestically.

There's other examples of this, 2 of the biggest being Spiderman 3 & Pirates 3. They both made A LITTLE over $300 million domestically, but with the foreign added in Spidey 3 made JUST UNDER $900 million & Pirates 3 made JUST OVER $900 million.

Admittedly, those are mega-popular franchises, but the foreign is sometimes double or even triple what the domestic take was. Also, this phenomenon isn't just limited to those type franchises. I check out boxofficemojo.com daily, & I've seen films, even recently, that BOMBED domestically, not even making back their budget THAT way, but then the foreign ends up being at least DOUBLE what the domestic was, so in that way they've MORE than made back their budget. I believe an example of this is THE GOLDEN COMPASS, which obviously flopped US-wise, but when you do the afore-mentioned of what I just said, you find that it was at least SOMEWHAT successful when you look at it THAT way. I see other examples of this too with VARIOUS films, that for whatever reason FLOPPED here, but succeeded overseas.

So what does this have to do with TIH? Well, a similar principle may apply. It's hard to say at this point. Right now the domestic is ahead, but that could change. Time will tell. If it does change, TIH could end up with a respectable total. I believe it even will domestically, even enough to warrant a sequel AND a continuation of this 'Marvel Universe' that Marvel Studios are trying to weave into their films that they have the rights to.

Oh, & I SEE what you're saying about WB & Singerman, but WB needs to get their act together with the Superman franchise REGARDLESS of what Marvel does or doesn't do. Forget Hulk for the moment. Currently Marvel is rolling right over WB/DC like a runaway train. I ask YOU, just exactly what does WB/DC intend TO DO about it?!

Oh, & let's also see how successful TIH is when the various DVDs are released.

Anonymous said...

"Currently Marvel is rolling right over WB/DC like a runaway train. I ask YOU, just exactly what does WB/DC intend TO DO about it?!"

That is the problem, i don't think they know what to do about it. They gave Singer a deal to develop a sequel and since then have clearly changed their minds as they have said nothing about any sequel happening in 2 years. So the only other option is to fire Singer, pay him off and get going on a reboot. However given how expensive it would be to boot Singer and make a new Superman movie, combined with the Hulk not doing big BO, has hurt Superman's shot at a reboot. If the film makes WW about the same or less than Singerman, WB i guarantee you is not thinking immediate reboot and that sucks.

Anonymous said...

Singer's used the Kryptonian crystals to shove in his anus.

Anonymous said...

Singer's love for cock is only exceeded by his disdain for vagina.